gc-forever - Gamecube/Wii Forums

emu_kidid wrote:it'll ask you on boot up (us PAL users aren't used to it) if you want Progressive Mode.

just to add, only games with 480p support will allow for a prompt to choose progressive mode or interlaced mode..
not all games will automatically prompt for progressive scan..holding B during game start up will initiate the prompt on those games without the auto prompt

for those not familiar with the prompt, here is a quick pic

ahhh okay thanks - yeah its pretty much like emu said...i mostly play PAL games

I'm also interested on one Component Cable with Digital Audio too. Or just a component cable if not possible!

Great work man! As a slight sidenote, I relocated the 3 large capacitors on the back of the normal component cable chip. Doing so caused my picture quality to be tinted (too much blue). Shortening the wires connecting the capacitors didn't seem to fix the problem. Should I use thicker wires?? Or are these caps truly sensitive to trace latency.

Tchay wrote:Great work man! As a slight sidenote, I relocated the 3 large capacitors on the back of the normal component cable chip. Doing so caused my picture quality to be tinted (too much blue). Shortening the wires connecting the capacitors didn't seem to fix the problem. Should I use thicker wires?? Or are these caps truly sensitive to trace latency.

as you can see from the image in the first post, i think we can rule out trace latency as the issue due to my overall cable lengths used on the breadboard..
if you relocated the capacitors by connected wires to the original capacitor pads, then i dont see an issue. if you bypassed the ferrite connections...then maybe that could be the reason for odd color..

for what reason did you relocate the caps??

Portablizing.

HAHA..right on!!

megalomaniac wrote:
as you can see from the image in the first post, i think we can rule out trace latency as the issue due to my overall cable lengths used on the breadboard..
if you relocated the capacitors by connected wires to the original capacitor pads, then i dont see an issue. if you bypassed the ferrite connections...then maybe that could be the reason for odd color..

for what reason did you relocate the caps??

What do you mean by "ferrite connections" ???? When I was removing the caps, for 2 of them, the pads got ripped off a little. But then I just soldered to the traces that went to the solder pads, so I was still connecting the caps to their respective points. It might also be the last 3 wires of the component cable that go out to some small filtering caps on the main mobo (I might have them mixed up).

Would thickening the wires for the caps make a difference???

if your connecting to the original traces and not performed any other mods to the board, then there "should not" be an issue and i dont think thicker wire would make much differences since the traces on the board are hairline traces anyhow...

the ferrites are labeled as FIL1 FIL2 FIL3.
ferrites act as line filters..i bypassed these ferrites at first for testing purposes but had some picture noise..
i then reconnected thru the ferrites and the picture looks great...

are your capacitors positioned in the correct polarity??
negative goes to R,G,B...positive goes to ferrite

My apologies. I'm an idiot. One of the cap traces didn't connect to the rest of the trace as it was torn slightly. I then wired to the rest of the trace and all colors returned properly.

SO, this means you can relocate the caps without worry. The only real issue with component is that its a major ground hog. It needs EXCESSIVE grounding to avoid any flicker. And its almost impossible to get composite to show its proper picture after you wire up component (note that I'm talking about a specific 5" TFT that Ashen, I, and most of modretro use). But after using VGA and progressive, theres really no reason to go back to crappy composite.

Anyhow, sorry for jacking the thread. Thx for your help

good to hear ya got it working...

just adding a few notes..more to come later



RGB color is delivered via various connection types using different delivery methods.

two key definitions:
1. Luminance = brightness in an image (inversely, also the darkness in the image)
2. Chrominance = difference between blue and luminance AND difference between red and luminance.


Composite video connector (yellow colored cable) delivers analog signal known as Composite Video, Blanking, and Sync...CVBS.
RGB video information is converted to luminance and chrominance.
These converted signals are combined along a single carrier cable.
Resolutions supported up to 480i (NTSC standard) or 576i (PAL standard).


S-video connector (DIN cable) delivers analog signal similar to composite video.
RGB video information is converted to luminance and chrominance.
Unlike composite video, S-video luminance and chrominance signals are carried along separate cables within the same connector.
The separation of these signals improve image color and clarity compared to Composite video.
Resolutions supported up to 480i (NTSC standard) or 576i (PAL standard).


Component video connector (R,G,B colored cables) delivers analog signal known as YPBPR.
Component connectors are commonly referred to as RGB video which is incorrect since RGB colors are converted to YPBPR color space, but this confusion is common since the component cables are colored Red, Green, Blue.
RGB video information is converted into 3 separate signals.
Green cable = Y = combined luminance and synchronization
Blue cable = PB = difference between blue and luminance
Red cable = PR = difference between red and luminance
Unlike Composite video and S-video with one chrominance signal, Component cables deliver two separate color difference signals represented by PB and PR. (see definition of chrominance).
Component video signal separation allows delivery of a higher quality signal in regards to color and clarity.
Resolutions supported up to 1080p however, many video components will only send video up to 1080i due to copyright protection.


VGA connector delivers analog RGB signal with Horizontal and Vertical sync.
NO RGB conversion.


Scart video connector is a beast. Composite, S-video, RGB(with composite sync), YPBPR capable, audio...





Key notes:
Composite video combines 1. Luminance and 2. Chrominance signals on a single cable.
S-video separates 1. Luminance and 2. Chrominance on a single cable.
Component video further separates 1. Luminance and 2a. difference between blue and luminance and 2b. difference between red and luminance to three separate cables.
VGA connector = RGB with Horizontal and Vertical sync
Scart video connector is a beast.


YPBPR is not RGB
YPBPR is not RGBhv
RGB is not RGBhv



The MX chip will output two video color formats: YPBPR, RGBhv
The MX chip can output video using three methods: Component, D-Terminal, and VGA (maybe scart??)
The MX chip has the ability to send video at various rates: YPBPR = 60Hz, RGBhv = 15khz & 31khz
The MX chip can deliver these combinations of options in two modes: interlaced video and progressive scan (ONLY IF SUPPORTED by software title)

YCBCR is a digital conversion of RGB.
YPBPR is an analog conversion of RGB.
The Gamecube converts RGB into digital YCBCR.
The MX chip converts digital YCBCR into analog YPBPR or RGBhv

Oh are we walking to a day that we won't need the Nintendo cable to use 480p??

hopefully if my project goes as planned we wont need the "official cable"...
ive put a lot of thought and effort into this project..

so far, things are looking good for making a custom compatible version...
not to mention plans are in the works to have the cable compatible with YPBPR output as well as RGBhv output at the flip of a switch...
did i mention it will also have on board fiber optic audio output??

this will be the all in one super deluxe awesome cable!

Do you need the MX chip or you can programm another thing like PIC?

Just curious, which ic are you going to use? i saw someone using a tc9231n but it seems that IC is a little scarce and also very expensive.
http://www.gamesx.com/wiki/doku.php?id=av:nintendogcda
what are the options to convert the i2s signal from the cube to toslink?

Also I noticed that the digital audio is a separate circuit, it doesn't has to pass thru the mx chip so it can even be made as an internal mod in the gamecube, you can offer it as a kit too.
the same can be said about the whole component circuit, people who ditched the optical drive in their cubes will find an awesome way to fill up all that empty space

iggunr wrote:Just curious, which ic are you going to use? i saw someone using a tc9231n but it seems that IC is a little scarce and also very expensive.
http://www.gamesx.com/wiki/doku.php?id=av:nintendogcda
what are the options to convert the i2s signal from the cube to toslink?

The cool thing about the TC9231 is its ability to be used for digital audio in other equipment, not just Gamecube..
SNES(??)
Saturn
Dreamcast
Playstation
MIDI instruments


the bad thing, It appears these digital audio mods are not popular due to the chip being hard to find or too expensive as you have posted.
I almost killed the idea when i read posts indicating the going price for the chip was about $40-$50 due to it being discontinued. I then thought about a compatible chip such as the TC9271 but that is also discontinued, not to mention the circuit would need to be redesigned since the chip is not a drop in replacement.

in order to perform the digital audio mod there are only 2 choices:
1. find a TC9231
2. redesign the circuit with an available chip


im going to take the easy road and use the original design/chip.

iggunr wrote: Also I noticed that the digital audio is a separate circuit, it doesn't has to pass thru the mx chip so it can even be made as an internal mod in the gamecube, you can offer it as a kit too.
the same can be said about the whole component circuit, people who ditched the optical drive in their cubes will find an awesome way to fill up all that empty space

Correct...
the digital audio mod does not require the MX chip, nor does it need the official component cable. The only practical reason this mod requires the official component cable is to access the data pins thru the cable's port connector. With that being said, digital audio can be added to any Gamecube DOL-001 without the official component cable as long as those connections are added internally with only a few simple solder points.
The component video board can also be added internally with the optical drive removed and some soldering..or add it to GC portable projects.
it could also be added internally with the drive still connected, just a bit harder.


First i need to finish the project...then i can provide more specific details..

the breadboard has served its initial purpose..
with wires connect all over in a huge mess, it was time to clean up a little and make a development board.

works great...more testing to be done...

I might have access to a small supply of MX B012355 chips. I plan on internalize the circuit normally contained in the component cable and mount 3 phono jacks on the Gamecube itself for component out. Anyone knows where I could find the schematic for interfacing it?

I haven't bought the chips yet but I think that this could be an awesome alternative to buying a GC component cable! You guys think it could work?

psyko_chewbacca wrote:I might have access to a small supply of MX B012355 chips. I plan on internalize the circuit normally contained in the component cable and mount 3 phono jacks on the Gamecube itself for component out. Anyone knows where I could find the schematic for interfacing it?

I haven't bought the chips yet but I think that this could be an awesome alternative to buying a GC component cable! You guys think it could work?

saw this earlier on gc-forever's wiki http://www.gc-forever.com/wiki/index.ph ... =MXB012355
component rca ports built into the gamecube... that's exactly what I want to do.
I'd buy a single mx chip, I want to join the fun too!

I will probably order like 10 of those. I'm half confident about these. I know that they are discontinued parts but my supplier recently sold me other discontinued MX chips which turned out to be genuine, brand new and perfectly working.

The quote I received from him today is a little pricey, $10 USD a pop plus shipping. That means about $125 USD for 10. I have 2 or 3 GC with digital ports that I could mod and sell. I could sell the other chips afterward. I just don't want to get anyone's hope too high if this turns out to be a scam.

Anyone knows if the Gamecubes without a digital port still have the data signals required for the chip internally?

I don't know anything for sure, but the Mainboard is different in other revisions...So I guess they removed the digital out stuff when they already redesigned the board...

iggunr wrote: saw this earlier on gc-forever's wiki http://www.gc-forever.com/wiki/index.ph ... =MXB012355
component rca ports built into the gamecube... that's exactly what I want to do.
I'd buy a single mx chip, I want to join the fun too!

that schematic on the wiki needs another update, but for the most part, yea its correct.
ill put up more info on the wiki soon

psyko_chewbacca wrote:I will probably order like 10 of those. I'm half confident about these. I know that they are discontinued parts but my supplier recently sold me other discontinued MX chips which turned out to be genuine, brand new and perfectly working.

The quote I received from him today is a little pricey, $10 USD a pop plus shipping. That means about $125 USD for 10. I have 2 or 3 GC with digital ports that I could mod and sell. I could sell the other chips afterward. I just don't want to get anyone's hope too high if this turns out to be a scam.

Anyone knows if the Gamecubes without a digital port still have the data signals required for the chip internally?

i recently ordered 24 chips from the supplier i contacted..

10$ a pop sounds like a good price.
better than what i purchased them for..
If you dont want to front the cash for the order, PM me your supplier info and ill make the purchase to add those to my upcoming production..

its gonna be a slow process to get all the parts in..still waiting for the main goods to show up
I know you portable guys will really benefit from a cheaper supply of chips..If you have any recommendation for designs to help make your projects easier, let me know..
currently im considering a one sided board, this should "help" with shielding..

currently, this project is aimed toward modders since i currently have not attempted to make an external digital port connector.
if i can make an acceptable port connector, then the door is open for anyone..


here are the component video connectors..